Official Guinness Ruling on Heathrow T5

[joy54]

Thank you for your enquiry regarding your intention to attempt the record for 'Fastest time to travel to all London Underground stations'.

The current record (current as at the date of this letter) is:
Category opened for applications for the tube network as of 27 March 2008 (i.e. following the closure of the East London Line as part of the London Underground on 22 December 2007 and the opening of Heathrow Terminal 5 on 27 March 2008). Minimum time: 18 hours 15 minutes

You may wish to check with us again closer to submitting your full claim to be sure that a new record has not been set in the interim.

Please note that any current record information is provided to you to the best of Guinness World Records knowledge and belief as at the date of this letter and is based on the record information currently logged on the Guinness World Records database. This current record may change at any time due to a new record being approved. You are responsible for keeping yourself up to date with any new records as Guinness World Records will not inform you of any change to the current record.

We have attached specific Guidelines for this record category which detail the requirements you must follow to make your record attempt. You should ensure that all those participating and those witnessing the attempt are aware of the contents of these Guidelines. We would also draw your attention to the specific authentication we require when you come to make your claim for this particular category. This is in addition to the general authentication requirements as detailed in the Record Breakers Pack also included with this email.
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So only 5 minutes added to the minimum time from last time, I just suppose they didn't take into account the wait at Terminal 4. It was very quick for them to sort this out though as I rang at about 11am and by 4pm I had the email with the details.

[palkanetoijala31]

Just for your information my attempt yesterday my wait at terminal 4 was 23 secs so does that count as a long wait?

[snudge27]

From what I've read on the TFL website, I think that the wait at T4 is planned to be about 4mins; so not excessively long, no

[palkanetoijala31]

I think at T4 u have to way up the options and have someone maybe at T5 telling u when the next train is and whether its a risk to take the bus it wasnt bad for me no wait at t4 1 min wait at t123 for t5 and a Flying Finn Choccy Bar there

[joy54]

Just for your information my attempt yesterday my wait at terminal 4 was 23 secs so does that count as a long wait?

I think its about 7 minutes wait in the WTT but the Piccadilly line seemed a little messed up yesterday with problems at Turnham Green and Wood Green so they probably just took the wait out at HT4, but you seemed to be extremely lucky yesterday I checked at various times of the day and all lines had a good service something very rare, with the only other problem a minor delay on the Bakerloo line for about an hour.

[palkanetoijala31]

well i had to have more luck beacuase the part i wanted was part suspended despite that i had no major delays at all day even though i had to avoid it up until the last moment which cost me a record due to victoria line early closing.

[Going Underground]

Right I am slightly confused on this ruling......

Assuming that GWR confirm the Soup Dragon/Dr Who/Ping pon time of 17hrs 30mins & 51secs (Pre T5 opening but after ELL closure)would this then still be the time to beat?
Obviously this is still being checked and processed and the last one took nearly 6 months......

Or are they saying that with T5 this a new configuration and lets say you complete the network is less than 18hrs 15mins
but not within the 17hrs 30mins & 51secs then this would be a new GWR

[palkanetoijala31]

Kevin i presumed that because they added 1 station a new record would have to be given Anthony team will forever hold the 268 record and 275 with u and starkey?i expect that when Wood Lane opens it will go up to 270?

[hwolge]

Right I am slightly confused on this ruling......

Assuming that GWR confirm the Soup Dragon/Dr Who/Ping pon time of 17hrs 30mins & 51secs (Pre T5 opening but after ELL closure)would this then still be the time to beat?
Obviously this is still being checked and processed and the last one took nearly 6 months......

Or are they saying that with T5 this a new configuration and lets say you complete the network is less than 18hrs 15mins
but not within the 17hrs 30mins & 51secs then this would be a new GWR

I think that this means:
A) This (HT5) is a new configuration!
B) Since they didn't have the 17h30m confirmed, they just modified the old ruling and this will clearly stand - even after 17h30m has been approved.
C) Yes, first time under the 18h15m limit will be considered a new record now!

I think the 17h30m was extremely well planned and executed for several reasons, perhaps the most important one was that the 7/8 minute delay at HT4 wasn't in the WTT at that point. In effect I'd say that it's now around 15-18 minutes harder than it was just after ELL closed (before timetable changes) - at least with a Heathrow finish.

[Root]

I'm pretty sure it means that there is now a new record up for grabs, and that you have to beat 18h15m to claim it.

Assuming all my figures are correct, the extra wait at T4 is 7 minutes, the journey between T4 and Ts123 is also 7 minutes, the average wait at Ts123 is 5 minutes and the journey between Ts123 and T5 is 3 minutes. If your route doesn't finish there, you'll have an average 5 minute wait at T5 for a train back out (needs to be confirmed), and then another 3 minutes to get back to Ts123. 7+7+5+3+5+3 = 30 minutes.

I'm not sure what the wait at T4 was before T5 opened, but I will assume it to be 1 minute like any other station. The time between T4 and Ts123 was also 7 minutes, so that makes 8 minutes that we can subtract from the 30 to leave 22 extra minutes for the new current configuration.

22 minutes for one extra station. Wow. Anyway, adding 22 minutes to the Browns' time of 17h30m results in 17h52m, so that should be used as a benchmark for actually improving the world record if you ask me. Guinness just seem to have been a bit generous.

If you're finishing at Heathrow, the benchmark should be 17h44m, but obviously Guinness can't make a separate ruling for that.

[dudey]

^ I agree with Ollie, the T5 extension and the timetabling associated with it means there has got to be a new record up for grabs now for it to be fair at all. The fact that it is a line extension means (to me) that this is a new network configuration.

Looking into the near future, the only change that will be occouring on the network is the opening of Wood Lane, which clearly doesn't create a new network configuration. So in that knowledge I think challengers can now go out and attempt this record safe in the knowledge that it will stand a for a fair while...

[Root]

Doesn't Wood Lane create a new configuration? I know it's just an additional station between two other existing stations, but it still changes things. Let's say, for some reason, your current route involves you leaving the Central Line at Latimer Road and going to a different line. Wood Lane's addition could create an extra double-back for you, and therefore an extra journey. Even if it doesn't necessitate an extra journey, you will lose at least a minute as the train slows down, stops, and then accelerates again. I think it will be, or at least should be, a new configuration.

[joy54]

Unfortunatly Guinness don't seem to care about if changes on the network take longer, e.g. taking the Shoreditch and Heathrow T4 replacement buses both adding over 10 minutes extra to routes, it seems they only change it if a new line is added or taken away, I also don't think it would be wise to request Guinness to do so as the reaction I seem to be getting from them is that the record doesn't matter that much to them and I worry that they will withdraw the category if the network changes every few months meaning that the record categories keeps having to be rested.

[moley]

The difference with Wood Lane is that it is not a terminal station. Yes it is an extra station but it is not a configuration change.

Logic says that Guiness should not extend the time limit for Wood Lane. I think that there was a honest confusion regarding the Shoreditch issue. It's only since Shoreditch has closed that the London Overground brand has been launched London wide and the public (dare I say, including GWR) have understood the changes that are happening to the ELL.

With regard to the Heathrow Terminal 4 replacement busses - I believe that GWR got it spot on. It is consistent with passing through Shepherd's Bush, Regent's Park and the only fair decision that they could have given.

Guiness have hundreds possibly thousands of requests each week for details or confirmation and hence why they can at times take a long time to get back to you. It also means that your requests are unlikely to catch too much attention.

[Lancaster Gate]

I think at T4 u have to way up the options and have someone maybe at T5 telling u when the next train is and whether its a risk to take the bus it wasnt bad for me no wait at t4 1 min wait at t123 for t5 and a Flying Finn Choccy Bar there

I'm a member of the Flyertalk air travel forum and in the last day or two there's been some discussion there of getting from T4 to T5 when transferring flights. The general concensus is that the best method is to use the Piccadilly Line in spite of the possible long wait for a train at T4 and the change at T123. The buses are not recommended!