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Posted: 06 Jul 2006, 13:45
by Going Underground
hwolge wrote:Here's a good one for residents of Hatton Cross:
                                    Arrive Depart
Epping                           11:36
Woodford                        11:51 11:54
Hainault                        12:03 12:05
Mile End                        12:29 12:31
West Ham                   12:37 12:38
Canada Water               12:49 12:50
Whitechapel        12:56 13:02
Liverpool Street      13:08 13:11
Aldgate                  13:14 13:15
Westminster                  13:27 13:28
London Bridge            13:34 13:35
Stockwell                  13:46 13:47
Victoria                        13:53 13:55
South Kensington         13:59 14:00
Piccadilly Circus         14:08 14:09
Charing Cross               14:10 14:11
Leicester Square         14:12 14:15
Holborn                           14:18 14:20
Bank                           14:25 14:26
Euston                           14:36 14:38
Tottenham Court Road 14:42 14:43
Notting Hill Gate         14:53 14:54
Gloucester Road         15:02 15:05
Earl's Court                  15:06 15:07
Acton Town (via Chiswick Park) 15:21 15:29
Rayners Lane                  15:48 15:54
Wembley Park                  16:07 16:10
Baker Street (via Neasden) 16:29 16:36
Harrow & Wealdstone         17:12
Thank you very much my friend
That just about looks perfect
Posted: 06 Jul 2006, 18:19
by greatkingrat
Those changes are a bit optimistic. You will struggle to get from Charing Cross Bakerloo to Northern in 1 minute!
Posted: 07 Jul 2006, 07:59
by hwolge
I agree that some changes are optimistic.
I actually do think 1 minute is quite doable at around 2pm. I seem to recall (but far from certain) that I measured 1m40s WALKING time for that particular change...
However, I never use exact JPL times to truly estimate a route. I use a statistical approach (adding "noise" to all listed times) - an approach that proved most reliable during my 275 attempt. The listing above is a mere example - but I'd say it's not completely improbable. What is not shown are a couple of changes where there actually is a back to back (same minute) connection (that I did not use) - that you'd probably make quite often... Also in this case, most of the changes are on fairly high frequency routes and the exact minutes are of less relevance. The only real low frequency service is the Woodford-Hainault one, but that connection should be ok on any decent day!
Posted: 07 Jul 2006, 08:41
by Going Underground
I didn't really concern myself with the connection times on high frequency routes. Yes I agree some of these are optimistic, especially for me
I think the imprtant thing in obtaining a good time is to minimise the waiting time on the first couple of changes at the Woodford / Hainhault loop end.... and this suggested start time does look pretty good
One other idea if we were to have a "129/Snake" challenge day then teams could set off at staggered times, similiar to a car rally
Posted: 07 Jul 2006, 14:44
by Root
The only way that would work would be if we started at H&W. Roughly every other train out of Epping has a "nice" connection with a Hainault train at Woodford, while the other one has a stinker - it would be awfully unfair on half of the competitors!
I'd probably be up for doing this though.
Posted: 08 Jul 2006, 19:49
by Going Underground
You could still start at Epping and draw teams out in order. The team drawn first doesn't necessarily have to take the next/first train departing, likewise after the first team have left the second team are not obliged to take the next train departing either......
As long as teams leave in the order drawn they can choose when to depart, of course I realise that this could mean a lot of hanging around at the start..........
Once you get into the route time can be lost and gained at the interchanges.....
Posted: 08 Jul 2006, 22:54
by Starkey7
I really like this rally idea. It's a shame that the Grange Hill and Co trains are only every twenty minutes; perhaps you could stagger the teams twenty minutes apart, rather than ten. Then there'd be no problem.
And you would see the effects of the unpredictable nature of the Underground on the teams' progress; you might get teams bunching or even overtaking!
Posted: 09 Jul 2006, 12:52
by Going Underground
Starkey7 wrote:I really like this rally idea. It's a shame that the Grange Hill and Co trains are only every twenty minutes; perhaps you could stagger the teams twenty minutes apart, rather than ten. Then there'd be no problem.
And you would see the effects of the unpredictable nature of the Underground on the teams' progress; you might get teams bunching or even overtaking!
Yes exactly what I thought, you are dashing to make an interchange and a team comes flying past you and overtakes
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 16:39
by Starkey7
Sorry for bumping again, but I think that I have a better route.
Er ... actually I'm not sorry; this is important! It still starts at Epping, but finishes at Heathrow. It involves a change between the District and Hammersmith and City lines at Hammersmith. And it ends up visiting 136 stations!
HÃ¥kan, is my Hammersmith trick allowed?
By the way, you said, "I actually do think 1 minute is quite doable at around 2pm. I seem to recall (but far from certain) that I measured 1m40s WALKING time for that particular change... " I did that change on my Bottle thingy. I literally sprinted all the way, and just made it in one minute. It's extremely difficult!
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 17:46
by greatkingrat
According to the rules in the original post changing between the Hammersmiths is not allowed. Having said that though I think it should be allowed as it is shown as an interchange on the tube map.
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 18:07
by Going Underground
greatkingrat wrote:According to the rules in the original post changing between the Hammersmiths is not allowed. Having said that though I think it should be allowed as it is shown as an interchange on the tube map.
Uh Oh I feel a Poll coming on here
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 18:19
by hwolge
No, no poll! The rules are based on the unfair but established rulings of GWR - and they stand!
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 20:36
by jonny
it's not shown as a direct interchange, though -- if you see what i mean -- the circles aren't linked as at bank/monument.
Posted: 18 Aug 2006, 22:37
by Starkey7
No, they're right. Thanks to whomever it was who reminded me of the "no changing between Hammersmiths". I'll stop poking my oar in now!
Besides, I don't want to finish at Heathrow. Harrow and Wealdstone is much nicer for Barbican.
Posted: 21 Aug 2006, 12:38
by hwolge
Here are 17 more 129 routes - all finishing at Heathrow:
http://lund.dyndns.org/palantir/Route129.txt
I've manually edited them, so there may be errors, and I may have neglected some routes (but I think not).