Geoff's Tube 18 - 13th February 2012

[Steeevooo]

As I have to travel on the Jubilee line every day to and from work, I can confirm that the service in the peaks is as bad now as it has been for ages. As has been mentioned above, statistics can be manipulated in any way the user pleases, but I would certainly take the opinion of someone who uses the line every day over a set of statistics.

Oh, and well done for being able to copy and paste a whole load of statistics and not even be able to analyse them any more than 5 or 6 words each.

[greatkingrat]

I think a tube challengers view of "good service" is different to the average passengers view of "good service". A train arriving at Stanmore 2 minutes late might muck up your route, but 99% of passengers will not notice or be bothered in the slightest. Remember that the working timetable is not intended to be used by the public, just because it says there is a 30 second connection in theory doesn't mean it will work in practice. The TfL statistics are more concerned with the big picture of the line as a whole rather than the exact timings of individual trains.

Also, I don't think the tube was ever as good as you seem to think. Just going through your early attempts you had problems every single time.

Tube 1 - signal failure at Gunnersbury, passenger alarm at South Harrow
Tube 2 - 13 min wait at Hainault, 16 min wait at Acton Town
Tube 3 - various long waits towards the end of the day
Tube 4 - 10 min delay at Golders Green, points failure at Kennington, ran to District line station that was closed
Tube 5 - 9 min wait for District, Eastern end of the Central screwed,
Tube 6 - points failure at East Finchley, 19 min wait at Woodford
Tube 7 - 25 min wait for MHE train, cancellation at Uxbridge, and you still broke the record!

The big difference is that when you first started, the record was a lot easier and you could afford a couple of delays and still have a chance at the record. Nowdays, every route is planned so exactly and the connections are so tight, that it just takes one minor delay of a few minutes and you can never get that time back.

[Steeevooo]

I'd love to contribute to your stats thread Geoff, but unless you actually keep a proper record of the attempts that you have done, then it's impossible to do! I know that I've now done 9 attempts, been successful 3 times (so there was evidently overall good service on at least 33% of my attempts), but really couldn't tell you the causes of the other non-GWR getting attempts - whether it was bad routing, human error or bad service. Gut feeling and day-to-day tubing to work knowledge tells me, as I mentioned earlier, that the service is no better now than it was 4 years ago.

[The Raven]

I think a tube challengers view of "good service" is different to the average passengers view of "good service". A train arriving at Stanmore 2 minutes late might muck up your route, but 99% of passengers will not notice or be bothered in the slightest. Remember that the working timetable is not intended to be used by the public, just because it says there is a 30 second connection in theory doesn't mean it will work in practice. The TfL statistics are more concerned with the big picture of the line as a whole rather than the exact timings of individual trains.

The big difference is that when you first started, the record was a lot easier and you could afford a couple of delays and still have a chance at the record. Nowdays, every route is planned so exactly and the connections are so tight, that it just takes one minor delay of a few minutes and you can never get that time back.

I have to agree with greatkingrat, the tube is not "designed" for tubechallenges. We are using transport in a way it was never designed for! Though don't think I'm leaping to the defence of TfL, even my limited experience I seen tube trains do some daft things! Besides you need that ONE perfect day, and your golden!

[Cheshire Cat]

It will be interesting to see whether TfL manage to operate a good service during Mrs Windsor's celebrations and the Olympics and, if they do, whether it continues thereafter. If so (and it is a BIG if), then we might be able to believe the propaganda. But somehow, I doubt it.

[tubeguru]

No doubt we will all be told how great the Tube is after the Olympics. Mind you, I can only see chaos myself ...

[palkanetoijala31]

So ... there seems to be a notion here of "it's no better than it was...", which (i'll say again) is bizarre considering how much time out they have (all those weekends) to get it going, and the big "We've got a plan" PR campaign - when really, at the very least - it's no better.

just today I was at West Brompton this morning on the north/eastbound platform, and there was a tourist asking the CSA which train to get to go to South Kensington. He looked up at the DMI and said "the one about to pull in now", at it was showing a City/Victoria train. At which point a Wimbleware pulled in, and I had to tell the lady that this was not the train she wanted, but to wait for the next one. Please TfL, please .. take some of your wasted PR money, and get the 'Next train' indicators to actually always work. Even if you don't run trains, or run them to time, get the information to the customers correct, it's appalling. And I can think of at least four others stations (all in my local area) where the 'Next train..' is often wrong. *Sigh*

Steveoo - no stats AT ALL? Who has all your logbooks with all your times written down!!? At a guestimate though, what %age would you say it fails. 66%? Or less ...

i have at least 4 of his attempts written down but the successfull ones Surely if u were at West brompton u would have told the lady just for one stop at least to earls court then she could have picked up a richmond or ealing broadway starter or even a pic to s ken

[Steeevooo]

Steveoo - no stats AT ALL? Who has all your logbooks with all your times written down!!? At a guestimate though, what %age would you say it fails. 66%? Or less ...

I don't have any definitive stats, no - I'm not always the logger on my attempts, and there has been at least one attempt where it went so badly that I ripped out the logbook pages and threw them away! That said, if I could be bothered I'm sure I could locate a couple of my books. At a guess from what little I can actually remember of my failed attempts, 2 or 3 would have failed because of a complete system failure and the rest probably due to the scenario you previously mentioned where one or two isolated incidents have cost a connection which has then snowballed into something bigger.

[palkanetoijala31]

tourist lady had bags, and the real City/Victoria train was just 2 mins behind. (which was obviously signed as an Edgware Road service). confused tourists just want to get on one train that will take them all the way there, no changing involved!

Stevooooo. (how many O's are in your name?). C'mon ... i'm struggling to get a %age out of you here! How many times has the system exploded in your face like a baby who's eaten liquroice and has diarrhoea.

i have no idea why i've gone with that analogy btw.

i think u have to ask him that question over a few beers cos thats where if his attempts fail usually end up in!

[Steeevooo]

Stevooooo. (how many O's are in your name?). C'mon ... i'm struggling to get a %age out of you here! How many times has the system exploded in your face like a baby who's eaten liquroice and has diarrhoea.

3 e's and 3 o's I'm not really sure how I'm supposed to give you %ages of data that I don't actually know the definitive results of, but if it keeps you happy I'll make up some %ages... 33% GWR success rate, 33% complete system **** up rate, 33% minor isolated incident rate. The first % is with a 100% degree of confidence, the other 2 %ages with a degree of confidence that would be on a par of you asking me how many people in the London Borough of Brent had brown rice with their dinner last night.

[hopeful traveller]

I sort of get the impression that it all falls down together... the day after your attempt was fine (or near enough).

[Starkey7]

What are the dumbed-down DLR timetables?

Are the stats compiled to reflect trains run, or journeys made? If the former, this would value an on-time train at midnight just as highly as an on-time rush-hour train. Is this right? Discuss.

[Iain]

Wasn't the Picc line problem on the 16th? I remember looking at that status update all day worrying if it would affect my start from Heathrow.

[Starkey7]

But that's just it. For example, Uxbridge trains from Hammersmith only go every twenty minutes - that is NOT a Metro-style frequency!

[hakc97]

When are you next trying again. And yes it was bad.