TUBE 4 1ST T5 ATTEMPT SOLO

Write-ups from those with over 21 full network challenge attempts
palkanetoijala31

Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by palkanetoijala31 »

Well i suppose ur right in a sense i would never give the door carriages and positions away or my knowledge of train numbers unless i was actually helping somebody on an attempt or doing it with somebody else and it was their route.

For example i know some other routes of people i have helped but i would never divulge them for the forum thats just not right as u say.

What part of Finland did u come from?I was born in Palkane and grew up in Toijala then Tampere hence the username then relocated to England when i was very young i still hold a residence in Tampere where my mate lives and keeps it nice and neat my share of a flat.

If u have been to Finland many times u know that the whole nation is sharing happy people who like nothing better to go out fish,drink and have sauna i can do 2 of them quite well never learnt how to fish though.It affects me every time i go back i feel i,ve come home hence and ask Ping Pon or Going Underground or Soup Dragon they all think i,m slightly nuts maybe thats why i divulged my route but its nothing thats somebody couldnt have got from a journey planner or drawn on a map besides Alistair Bell did it as well and my previous route is displayed in another topic for anyone to see.
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Root
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by Root »

I tried to stress in my post that it was not aimed specifically at anyone, it's nothing to do with you being "slightly nuts". I just wanted to have a general rant and have a discussion about it 8)

The conversation about Finland should perhaps be held somewhere else... but briefly: I wasn't born in Finland, I was born in a place called Hemel Hempstead (unfortunately), but my mother was Finnish. I still hold dual nationality, although as I dodged my conscription, I think I have to write a letter expressing that I want to keep it beyond my 22nd birthday, which isn't so far away. I've been a regular visitor throughout my life though - I've lost count of how many visits I've made exactly, but I think it's about 45. I'm sure there will be many more to come.
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joy54
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by joy54 »

I would say that when I started, I was helped alot by Alistair Bell's route and it gave me a starting point to some connections like Feltham to Hatton Cross etc. and the W12 from Snaresbrook to Walthamstow, but really those slight points were it. I think Geoff was helped a little by the book Tunnel Vision as he used to finish at Morden which is where the guy in that book started and if you look at it now nobody in their right mind would finish there, I don't really see anything new in Andy's route that hasn't been revealed elsewhere. Maybe Hakan could put it in his computer program and see how good of a route it actually is?
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Soup Dragon
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by Soup Dragon »

I agree with Ollie that revealing routes for the full network is not a good thing to do. If we have too much open debate on the subject eventually we could arrive at what is considered the optimum route then the record will purely be down to who can get the luck of good service on the day and will also favour the quicker runners amongst us (who already have an advantage). Also I don't think that we should make it that easy for newcomers, they should invest the time in working out a good route for themselves, there is one particular part of Andi's route that I think is very good and I certainly would not have made it public knowledge.
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jonny
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by jonny »

I see where Ollie's coming from here, and I don't directly disagree with any part of it, but I think it's probably OK for people to reveal their routes to each other if they are happy to do so. I will be honest and say I know the routes that various people have used, and not used them myself (with one exception discovered after the event).

Also, I do not see how helping someone with a route is in any way worse than giving an opponent support on the day of the challenge.
palkanetoijala31

Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by palkanetoijala31 »

ooh i love Hakan to psychoanalyse my route he was quite impressed with my last one can u do it on friday after i have finished though.I was influenced by the great Geoff Marshall and his tube exploits and my quiz master came from the gr8 60,s era of doing it when u had to go out to Ongar and further past Amersham and even Aldwych which must have been a pain doing probably like Mill Hill East is now.

Quite a few people have expressed their willingness to help throughout the day many thanks all
involved in advance.
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Going Underground
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by Going Underground »

Nothing personal here but I have to back Ollie and Antony

This is an open forum and nobody has strictly broken any of the rules that are laid down.....
For all of the reasons stated I do not think that it is a good idea to air full network routes in public in this way or indeed to then offer suggestions on how the route could be improved....

It is not just the members we have to consider here, 90% of which I know personally and would never doubt there honesty or intergrity.... There will be many others who just view the topics as guests.....
Just imagine if Andi has one of those typical days this week where the service is a nightmare and then someone else goes out and uses Andi's route with the suggested alteration and gets a GWR?

It is basically spoon feeding world records to people who have made no effort in terms of research or logistical planning.....

I for one wouldn't be happy to see a GWR acheived in this way, whether I was the current holder or not.....
Before our first attempt in Nov 2006 we spent several days both planning a route and then going out and researching all the interchanges and out of station runs & buses etc...

I have no objection if people want to talk about or reveal their routes to each other and suggest possible changes, but this should not be done on an open topic. Like jonny says this information can easily be obtained by offering support on the day anyway. Which is all fair game if you have taken the time and trouble to support someone then you are deserving of any knowledge you may gleam......

Like I say nothing personal and I agree that Andi is at the least "slightly nuts" and he is a good friend as is starkey, but I would be very happy if both the route and suggested change were deleted/ edited.......

Rant over......
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palkanetoijala31

Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by palkanetoijala31 »

I have now deleted said post so unless someone has a good memory it stay gone forever the Voice of Wisdom Kevin (maybe u could use that as a signature Going Underground) i bet he wished he taken my advice to run ahead of the bus last saturday now though.
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by Going Underground »

palkanetoijala31 wrote:I have now deleted said post so unless someone has a good memory it stay gone forever the Voice of Wisdom Kevin (maybe u could use that as a signature Going Underground) i bet he wished he taken my advice to run ahead of the bus last saturday now though.
Good work Andi.... :D

Best of luck on Thursday, be sure to text me and I can update on the forum if you like.......

Not sure about the voice of wisdom, like you say it wasn't a very wise decision to stay on that bus last week...... :roll:
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hwolge
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by hwolge »

joy54 wrote:I would say that when I started, I was helped alot by Alistair Bell's route and it gave me a starting point to some connections like Feltham to Hatton Cross etc. and the W12 from Snaresbrook to Walthamstow, but really those slight points were it. I think Geoff was helped a little by the book Tunnel Vision as he used to finish at Morden which is where the guy in that book started and if you look at it now nobody in their right mind would finish there, I don't really see anything new in Andy's route that hasn't been revealed elsewhere. Maybe Hakan could put it in his computer program and see how good of a route it actually is?
palkanetoijala31 wrote:ooh i love Hakan to psychoanalyse my route he was quite impressed with my last one can u do it on friday after i have finished though.
Indeed, I've tried to analyse all the public routes I've seen. Of course I can only do it in the context of the current time tables, and I've only done it assuming my lpersonal limited running capabilites. Some interesting things have emerged though. Alistar Bell's route wasn't very strong in my opinion some 45+ minutes worse than our old record route (adjusted for Shoreditch etc). Andy's (not Andi's) route in Tunnel vision is awful and the author cheats with the timing a lot. I think this was discussed at some length in another part of this forum a while ago). I especially remember that the entire Amersham corner was done in a pure fictional way... (BTW Tunnel Vision made me revive my boyhood dream of the GWR...)

As to your route, Andi, I did draw it on a map the other day, so I can still analyse it. I've been very busy lately so I haven't yet upgraded my time tables to a post HT5 status, but I will certainly do it (once again, assuming my limited running speed etc) - and I'll probably get back to you Andi in a PM to reveal parts of that analysis...
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jbom1

Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by jbom1 »

My conjectures are that

(1) The routes used now are significantly better (faster) than those used even a few years back - adjusting for network changes.

(2) The quality of routes is now close to convergence (most of the incremmental improvements that could have been made to routes from the last couple of years have indeed now been made).

(3) The recent record breaking routes are close to the global optimum (best possible route). I doubt that there is a quite different family of routes which we haven't thought of which are significantly faster than the current ones.

(4) The remaining and/or recent improvements are relatively small compared with the random variation between different runs on the same route.
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by geofftech »

Neil didn't do it nine times. He did it three times. *I* did it nine times - including the Tube Relief effort.
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by tubeguru »

He speaks the truth. I'm not sad enough to do nine. ;)
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Re: The not so secret attempt March 27th

Post by CrunchySaviour »

It's Geoff! Give me your stats, Geoff. Please.
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Re: TUBE 4 1ST T5 ATTEMPT SOLO

Post by geofftech »

palkanetoijala31 wrote:As previously discussed with several other forum members i will be attempting the full network for the 4th time this thursday.Catching the brown team up now quite quickly has anyone apart from the famous Bob Robinson tried more attempts than neil 9 times?.
Neils' never done it 9 times. I've done it nine times - the first six without out. He's only done it three times, and completed the whole network twice!
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